MILCH: Who? The Medical Inspection department? No.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: They were responsible officials doing their duty, as far as you know, is that right?
MILCH: Yes, Mr. Justice; but one must bear in mind the things which had come to pass during the war.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: That is exactly what I want you to think about and tell about. Why were these people, who were performing their duties in a government office, afraid of Himmler or afraid of the SS? Explain that situation to us.
MILCH: Not afraid of the SS as such, but of the secret police. It was not easy for any of us. We were all convinced that we were being constantly watched, no matter how high our rank. There was probably not a single person concerning whom a dossier was not kept, and many people were subsequently brought to trial as a result of these records. The ensuing difficulties did not affect only these people or other people or me personally; they included everybody right up to the Reich Marshal, who also was affected by them.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: So you mean that from the Reich Marshal right down to the humblest citizen, there was fear of Heinrich Himmler and his organization?
MILCH: Well, the degree of fear may have varied. It was perhaps not so great among those in the highest and in the lowest positions. But things were far more difficult in the intermediate grades, since it was quite clear that the intermediate grades criticized everything that occurred and these criticisms were not tolerated by the authorities at the top.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: I take it, from your testimony, that the reputation of the Gestapo was pretty well understood in Germany.
MILCH: Particularly so in the later war years. I could not say how far this feeling was justified, but at all events the feeling was there.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: Now, I think you also testified that some high military authorities did resign. I call your attention to your testimony in your interrogation by us about Von Fritsch and Beck. They resigned, didn’t they?
MILCH: No, they did not resign. They were removed.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: They were thrown out, is that it?
MILCH: Yes. They were told they were no longer needed.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: I understood you to testify in your interrogation that even the generals did not dare utter an opinion after those two left.
MILCH: No, I never put it like that. I cannot remember what I said. I should be grateful if I could see the minutes.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: Well, I have them. I will ask you if you were not asked these questions and gave these answers:
“Question: From your knowledge of discussions in army circles among the Air Force and the General Staff people whom you knew, could you form any opinion as to their attitude for the beginning of war? Would they share your view?”
The minutes show that you answered:
“All officers agreed with me unanimously. All the higher officers agreed with me. A long time ago, in 1937, I talked to Field Marshal Von Blomberg about the danger of a war because of the careless policy of our statesmen. At that time we feared that England or France would not tolerate that policy in the long run. On the 1st of November 1937, I had a long discussion with Von Blomberg about this matter, and he was of the same opinion.”
MILCH: Yes, I remember.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: That is true? You were then asked this question:
“Is it true that after General Fritsch and General Beck left their offices, the positions in the Army were subordinated to the political personalities?”
MILCH: No, they had always been subordinate. The Army was always changed in this respect. The head of the State was at the same time the Supreme Commander.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: At the time you were interrogated, your answer was this:
“Yes, because Hitler took over personally the Supreme Command of the Army, the Navy, and the Air Force. That was the position that was held by Von Blomberg before. Blomberg was in a position to resist Hitler, and he had done so very often, and Hitler respected him and listened to his advice. Blomberg was the only elderly soldier who was clever enough to reconcile military and political questions. This resistance . . .”
MILCH: Yes, that was my conviction.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: [Continuing.] “. . .This resistance could not be kept up by the men around Hitler later on. They were too weak for that. That is probably why he chose them.”
Is that true?
MILCH: That is my opinion.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: [Continuing.] “Question: Did the generals with whom you associated not feel, even before 1939, that the course of action which was being taken by Hitler would be likely to result in a war?
“Answer: Those who were able to think in foreign political terms, yes; but they had to be very cautious about it, because they could not utter any opinion; they dared not utter any opinion.”
Is that right?
MILCH: Correct.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: And of what were the high generals in command of the Army afraid, that they did not utter an opinion?
MILCH: The generals would not have had a chance to report anything to Hitler.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: Who would have done anything about it? There were many generals and only one Hitler. Who was going to carry out any orders against them?
MILCH: It was just not possible. Hitler was so powerful that he just turned down other people’s objections or else refused to listen to them at all.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: And Hitler had the SS, didn’t he, and Himmler and Kaltenbrunner?
MILCH: Yes, he had them as well. In addition he had the entire Wehrmacht who had sworn an oath of allegiance to him.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: I think you said in your interrogation that after the 5th of March 1943, Hitler was no longer normal. Did you make that statement?
MILCH: I said that, in my opinion, the Hitler of the later years was not the Hitler of the early period from 1933 until the outbreak of war, and that after the campaign against France a change came over him. I formed this opinion, which was a purely private one, because what he did afterwards was diametrically opposed to what he had previously taught; and that I could not consider normal.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: And you want us to understand that Göring continued to act as second man in the Reich and to take the orders from an abnormal man from that period on? Is that your story?
MILCH: The abnormality was not such that one could say, “this man is out of his senses,” or, “this man is insane”; it would not have to reach that stage. It often happens that abnormalities are such that they escape both the public and the nearest associates. I believe that a doctor would be better able to give information on that subject. I talked to medical men about it at the time.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: And it was their opinion that he was abnormal?
MILCH: That there was a possibility of abnormality was admitted by a doctor whom I knew well, personally.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: A doctor of repute in Germany?
MILCH: No, he is not very well known. He never told anybody else. It would not have been wise to do so.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: If he had, he would have been put in a concentration camp, I suppose?
MILCH: Or worse.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON: And if you had expressed your opinion that he was abnormal, you probably would have been put there also, would you not?
MILCH: I would have been shot immediately.
MR. JUSTICE JACKSON; So you never dared