Mr. Rankin. Who told you that there was—they had found another suspect?
Mrs. Oswald. One of the officers. That, sir, I don't know. He just walked in real fast while we were sitting down and said they had picked up another suspect, and it was in the paper that they had picked up another suspect at that particular time, which would have been approximately 1 o'clock that day.
Mr. Rankin. But you don't remember the officer's name?
Mrs. Oswald. No, sir, that is all he said and he left. He was just relaying why we would be delayed. But it was also published. I do not have the paper or the information. But I do know from the reporters, when I told my story, that part to them—they said that substantiates the newspaper story that they did pick up a suspect at that time.
Mr. Rankin. About how long did you and Marina spend there with your son?
Mrs. Oswald. I would say I spent about 3 or 4 minutes on the telephone, and then Marina came back to the telephone and talked with Lee. So we left. So Marina started crying. Marina says, "Mamma, I tell Lee I love Lee and Lee says he love me very much. And Lee tell me to make sure I buy shoes for June."
Now, here is a man that is accused of the murder of a President. This is the next day, or let's say about 24 hours that he has been questioned. His composure is good. And he is thinking about his young daughter needing shoes.
Now, June was wearing shoes belonging to Mrs. Paine's little girl, Marina told me—they were little red tennis shoes, and the top was worn. They were clean, and the canvas was showing by the toe part, like children wear out their toes.
I ask you this, gentlemen. If Marina had a hundred and some odd dollars in the house, why is it necessary that my son has to tell her at the jailhouse, remind her to buy shoes for his baby, for their child? Just a few dollars out of that hundred and some odd dollars would have bought shoes for this particular child.
Another way to look at this, as I stated previously—that the boy is concerned about shoes for his baby, and he is in this awful predicament. So he must feel innocent, or sure that everything is going to be all right, as he told me.
Mr. Rankin. Now, in this telephone conversation, when you talked to your son, can you explain a little bit to the Commission how that is? Was your son on the other side of a wall or something?
Mrs. Oswald. Yes, sir. My son was on the other side of the wall, and then back of the wall was a door with a peephole, where an officer was.
Now, we are going to come from the door, with the peephole and the officer, to my son. Then a glass partition and then glass partitions like telephone booths. But not really inclosed—just a little separation.
Mr. Rankin. So you could not reach in there and take your son's hand?
Mrs. Oswald. No, sir. We talked by telephone.
Mr. Rankin. And he had a telephone on his side, and——
Mrs. Oswald. And he had a telephone.
Mr. Rankin. And you talked back and forth?
Mrs. Oswald. Back and forth, that is right. That is the way we talked. And the boy was badly beat up. I have proof in the papers—his face, black eyes, all scratched up, his neck was scratched. He was badly beat up. But he assured me they were not mistreating him, that he got some of the bruises in the scuffle. As I say, the boy, if he was being mistreated, would not tell his mother that.
Mr. Rankin. And whatever Marina said to him was in Russian, and you didn't understand it?
Mrs. Oswald. No, sir, I did not understand. But I would say this, it seemed to be just an ordinary pleasant conversation. He was smiling. And she told me he said he loved her very much, she said she loved him, and told about buying the shoes for the baby. That is all she said. She did not tell me any other part of the conversation. And they talked quite a while. She talked with him twice. She talked with him the first time. I got on the phone. Then she talked to him again.
Mr. Rankin. Did it sound like there was any dispute or argument?
Mrs. Oswald. No. It was a pleasant conversation. But she did not volunteer to tell me what was said, and I did not ask her what was said.
Mr. Rankin. What did you do after that?
Mrs. Oswald. So then after that we went back to the Adolphus Hotel. And upon arriving at the hotel—I am a little ahead of my story.
The police and the detectives at the Dallas jail were most courteous to Marina and I. There were hundreds of reporters out in the corridor. And we were getting ready to leave, so they said that they would take us down the back way—incidentally, the same place where my son was shot. And they had arranged for two to go down and to get a car and to bring into this basement, and take us down the back elevator, and try to avoid the reporters. And there were approximately six or seven in the elevator. When we got down there, there were just a few reporters, and they went way out of their way to elude any reporters. We were at the Adolphus Hotel as I explained to you. And instead of from the jail going straight to the Adolphus Hotel, they drove around 20 or 25 minutes time in circles in order to lose anybody who might be following Marina and I.
So, as we got to the floor of the Adolphus Hotel, we knocked on the door where we were, and no one answered. We were with two men. Immediately around the corner comes Mr. Tommy Thompson, the Life representative.
Mr. Rankin. What two men were you with?
Mrs. Oswald. Two men from the Dallas courthouse.
Mr. Rankin. From the police?
Mrs. Oswald. Yes, from the police.
So Mr. Tommy Thompson came and they asked for his credentials. I had never even—as thorough as I am trying to be—I am trying to tell you there are some things I don't know because of the confusion—I didn't ask for the credentials. I could have been with anybody. I just assumed they were Life representatives. I had not asked. But these Dallas detectives or police, in plain clothes, asked Mr. Tommy Thompson for his credentials, and then left us in his care again.
Immediately Mr. Tommy Thompson said, "Mrs. Oswald, what do you plan to do now?"
The interpreter was gone, and so was the other representative, Mr. Allen Grant.
I said, "Well, the arrangement was that we were going to stay here in the hotel for a few days, and you were going to pay expenses."
He said, "But you have not given us any facts."
They were not interested—and to me it seems very strange that they were not interested in my conversation at the jail with my son. They did not even ask if we saw Lee. Yet they knew we left the Adolphus Hotel in order to go see Lee. But they did not even ask if we saw Lee. And I have often wondered about that.
So when I told him that we expected to stay there, he said, "Well, Mrs. Oswald, the reporters will be coming in flocks, they know where you are. Just a minute."
He got on the telephone. Mr. Allen Grant—they had a Life—the Life representatives had a room on the ninth floor where they had a lot of men working on this case, and we were on the 11th, I believe. So Mr. Allen Grant came down from the ninth floor with another man—I do not know his name—because the baby's diapers had to be changed and things of this sort. He said, "Mrs. Oswald"—they left. Tommy Thompson said, "Mrs. Oswald, what we are going to do is get you on the outskirts of town, so the reporters won't know where you are, and here is some money for your expenses in case you need anything."
Well, I took the bill, and I put it in my uniform pocket without looking at it. That may sound strange to you gentlemen, but this is confusion. I knew it was money, and I just put it in my uniform pocket.
So Mr. Allen Grant escorted my daughter-in-law and I out of the hotel, the Adolphus Hotel, and took us to the Executive Inn, which is on the outskirts of Dallas. We sat in the car. He went in and came out, then, and said, "Mrs. Oswald, I have arranged for you all to stay here for 2 or 3 days. I have to be back in